Christian Photographers Community

Wow know im 2nd guessing my choice of christian music...

Id love to hear your thoughts!!!


http://www.av1611.org/crock.html

I think Christian rock music is a wonderful thing. I don't think that rock artists are infallible, but I don't think that those who make some arguably poor decisions should be grouped with the majority who make good decisions and have a heart that's set on God. I also don't think that we should completely disregard the difference between a group and who they are reaching out to. Perhaps these teenage girls yelling "I love you" are non-Christian girls who don't know God, and that they end up leaving this concert knowing a little more about Him, maybe even having a relationship with Him? I've been to two Newsboys concerts and they put on a phenomenal Christian concert with both good music, and testimony-sharing, leading to an invitation for others to know Christ. Rock artists often sing of the pain in peoples' lives, and how else can we reach those who love this genre of music and reject all others? Skillet and Relient K have songs that could be speaking about either God or just a really good friend, and these are both positive messages. Yet, they do still stay clean, and talk about Jesus and God. I don't think it's blasphemy at all to be giving a positive message to the hurt, letting them know that they're not alone in their suffering, and introducing them to Jesus in this way. There are rock songs that are completely negative, that speak of satanic, violent, and impure things, but Christian rock groups sing songs that positively deal with these issues. Some talk about people who cut their wrists, some talk about eating disorders, some speak of suicide - but this is because that is what people in their demographic (and everywhere, to be sure) are dealing with, and they encourage these people, speak to them, and show love to them through their music. I think Christian rock groups shine their light in a very dark place, and with their hearts set on Jesus, I think God blesses and uses them as much, if not more than, other Christian music groups, to bind up the brokenhearted, just as Jesus did on earth.

I decided to have a look at the link mrsbentine provided for us, and it is a book of an article, with much going over more or less the same ground, but I did find in it this about drums, they are the heart of any form of rock music, and yes I can agree that drums set up a transic rhythm that appeals to the flesh, and especially in the past 25-30 years since the advent of house music, I once gave up on music altogether, didn't want to know. When I became a Christian, I got heavily into punk rock, it was a song called Shot By Both Sides, Magazine, that attracted me. I've still listened to it occasionly, as the tune was fascinating. I once went to see Worl Wide Message Tribe over in Rochdale some years ago, yes they preach Jesus throughout their gigs, but having read this article, I'm not so sure that it is the message of the gospel or the rhythm and beat that is so attractive, and yet they were outreaching to thousands of kids throught the Greater Manchester area. Going into schools, etc.

The biggest annoyance these days are i pods (well named, as I in my own little world) and mobile phones, they are not very loud, but the tinny tss, tss, tss, is truly irritating, I think they are a Satanic tool to indoctrinate young minds, I don't know enough enough about the subject to write about it.

On the subject of drums in the article below, how do we apply what's been written to classical music, where drums are used for effect there, and yet not to become the main instrument as in rock music, just how fine a line do we draw on the subject.

And finally, ever listened to some of those old hymns, some of them really are dirges, almost tuneless, and words that don't bear much resemblence to the joy we should be experiencing in God's saving grace, and what of the tunes and hymns we personally don't like, a few of them I could name, and some of them were once secular songs. Then again we have no idea what the hymns were like that the Apostle Paul was encouraging the early Christians to sing, or how and what the temple psalms sounded like, remember Solomon wrote 3000 psalms himself, so how many more did other people write? Did the early Christians also make up their own spiritual songs, like many of our choruses today? Of course we'll never know, and the bible doesn't tell us, but thanks for bringing it up, it should affect our thinking towards what we listen too, course we're going to get it wrong, but it should help be a guideline. Oh and just one other thing, the examples of music that were used in this article were heavy metal bands.

 


Rock music emphasizes that HARD, driving BEAT. What instrument do you hear more than any other in rock? What instrument is it that pounds out that heavy beat?

THE DRUM

The Bible lists many kinds of instruments: Psalms 150:3-5 says:

3 Praise him with the sound of the trumpet: praise him with the psaltery and harp.
4 Praise him with the timbrel and dance: praise him with stringed instruments and organs.
5 Praise him upon the loud cymbals: praise him upon the high sounding cymbals. Psalms 150:3-5

With all the many references to musical instruments, there is one instrument that is NEVER mentioned! The DRUM! Why is that? The drum was a very common instrument in Egypt and the lands around Israel. And yet the DRUM is NEVER mentioned in a King James Bible.

Did the Lord just forget to include the DRUM or is there another reason?

Is it because — drums are associated with voodoo, shamanism, paganism and magic rituals?

"[Drums] represents the beat of the heart and is played to summon up magic powers." (Miranda Bruce-Mitford, The Illustrated Book of Signs & Symbols, DK Publishing, 1996 p.80)

"The shaman was the original 'long hair', the first rock star draped in leather, dancing POSSESSED to a rhythm banged out on A DRUM." (Danny Sugerman, Appetite for Destruction, p. 208)

In Siberia, in northern Asia, drums are used in shamanic rituals to heal people. It is believed that the shaman can communicate with the spirit world THROUGH DRUMMING. (Louise Tythacott, Musical Instruments, Thomas Learning, 1995, p. 37)

"Pagan dances and rituals are always accompanied by the incessant BEAT of DRUMS. Rhythm plays a major role in these demonic activities." (Hart, Lowell Satan's Music Exposed, Salem Kirban Inc., 1980 p.71)

Robert Palmer is a contributing editor to Rolling Stone and other rock magazines. Palmer has also taught courses in music at Yale, and many other universities. Palmer was the chief advisor for the highly acclaimed "History of Rock 'n' Roll" that aired on public television. Palmer, an advocate and lover of rock music, is among the leading authorities on rock music. Here's what Palmer says about rock and the drum:

"Bata drums [drums used in voodoo], sacred to the Yoruba people of Nigeria and Cuba: Their push and pull provided a template for the inner rhythms of rock and roll." (Palmer, Robert Rock & Roll An Unruly History, Harmony Books, New York, 1995 p.46)
"The idea that certain RHYTHM patterns or sequences serve as conduits for spiritual energies, linking individual human consciousness with the gods, is basic to traditional African religions, and to African-derived religions throughout the Americas. And whether we're speaking historically or musicologically, the fundamental riffs, licks, bass figures, and drum rhythms that make rock and roll can ultimately be traced back to African music of a primarily spiritual or ritual nature. In a sense, rock and roll is a kind of 'voodoo' . . . ," (Robert Palmer, Rock & Roll, An Unruly History, Harmony Books, New York, 1995 p.53)

Palmer describes how drums are used in "voodoo" possession — and the same drum patterns are part of the basics of rock 'n' roll and CCM!

"Bata drummers tap out their toques, or rhythm patterns, like signals to the realm of the gods, inviting and enticing them to come on down and mount or POSSESS their horses, or devotees. . .The specific drum patterns or toques include some riffs and licks basic to the rock and roll vocabulary." (Palmer, Robert Rock & Roll An Unruly History, Harmony Books, New York, 1995 p.62)
Here's an episode from the occult, new-age magazine, New Age Journal, describing the "possessing" power of drums. Notice, even the devotees of the occult stay away from those drums:

"I remembered a conversation I'd once had in Cuba with a reporter from The New York Times, 'Stay away from those drums,' he had told me, referring to the ones said to call down the gods in Santeria's sacred ceremonies. 'If I ever really gave in to those DRUMS, my life would change in ways I'm not prepared to take on,' he had added. I knew what he was talking about. It was all there in the drumming. Listen long enough, and some energy field, some kind of interconnectedness, became palpable. I was hungry for those drums. Yet I still ran from them." (A Shaman's Story, by Elizabeth Hanly (A Vodoun priest leads the author on a journey of understanding, New Age Journal, March/April 1997 pp.56-57)
Little Richard, the self-professed "architect of rock 'n roll", readily admits Satan's control and influence in his life and rock music:

"My true belief about Rock 'n' Roll — is this: I believe this kind of music is demonic . . . A lot of the BEATS in music today are taken from voodoo, from the voodoo DRUMS." (Charles White, The Life and Times of Little Richard, p. 197)
Danny Sugerman, an authority on rock music, and author of several books on rock, writes in Appetite for Destruction:

"The shaman was the original 'long hair', the first rock star draped in leather, dancing possessed to a rhythm banged out on a DRUM. . . To these people, communication with the gods was synonymous with DRUMS . . .the body can become the conduit for a deity, a deity not necessarily the same sex as the worshiper, and DRUMS are the catalyst for the whole process. The trance of the RHYTHM then begets the hysteria, which begets what Westerners simplistically call 'possession'." (Danny Sugerman, Appetite for Destruction, p.208, 181)
David Tame writes in The Secret Power of Music:

"Today's DRUMMER differs but little from the shaman in his incessant beating out of a rhythm, and likewise often enters into a form of trance while performing." (The Secret Power of Music, David Tame, p. 199)
The DRUM has always been associated with the paganism and the devil. In fact, a little more than a hundred years ago, drums were forbidden (exy th for the military) in America!

"The arrival of African slaves has had one of the strongest influences on North American music. In the seventeenth and eighteenth centuries, millions of African people were taken as slaves to the U.S. to work on plantations in the South. They brought many of their own traditions with them but were forbidden to play their DRUMS." (Louise Tythacott, Musical Instruments, Thomas Learning, 1995, p.19)
Do you know why New Orleans is the voodoo capital of the U.S, and also the birthplace of jazz? Because drumming was forbidden in the U.S. – except in New Orleans!

"This was especially true in New Orleans. African-based DRUMMING, singing, and dancing, discouraged and repeatedly banned elsewhere in North America, had flourished there since the early eighteenth century. This unique heritage has informed and enlivened New Orleans music ever since, as well as distinguishing it from the rest of American musical culture, making the city an ideal incubator for a nonmainstream music as rhythmically oriented as rock and roll. (Palmer, Robert Rock & Roll An Unruly History, Harmony Books, New York, 1995 p.21)
When the first blacks from Africa were converted to Christianity they knew the power and evil influence of DRUMS. And the converted blacks strictly forbid the use of drums! They referred to the drums as "the Devil's drum". (Martha Bayles, Hole in Our Soul: The Loss of Beauty and Meaning in American Popular Music, p. 138)

"Historically blacks had drawn the line between particular instruments and practices; They permitted tambourines, for instance, but not DRUMS." (Martha Bayles, Hole in Our Soul: The Loss of Beauty and Meaning in American Popular Music, p. 130)
One simple guideline for Christian music is NO DRUMS!

My answer ... There is Love!  It's not rock, but it's so good!

Chris Tomlin and Watoto (these wonderful young people performed at our church here in Japan, just before returning to Uganda)

http://www.tangle.com/view_video?viewkey=be6f7327b970c4ac07f9

All three of our pastors play drums, including yours truly.  And my drum is a djembe, too!

In His Grip,
Kevin

Our pastor's oldest son plays the drums during our Praise and Worship time and the pastor often joins in on the bongos.  The Praise leader is a young man who plays - or should I say pounds - an electronic keyboard and is joined by at least two guitars and usually a tambourine.  The three or four songs we sing at that time are often more shouting than singing and not really my "cup of tea" musically, but the repetitive lines are clear with the message of God's love and salvation.  And I keep reminding myself that David exhorted us to "Make a joyful noise unto the Lord".  During the rest of the service we sing two or three traditional songs from the hymnal, and that way everyone is kept happy.

That link gives a lot of gossip.  Gossip is condemned in the Bible.  I believe that these people need prayer.  I have been blessed by many of these singers, and will continue to pray for them.

Mom, here is one of the verses you asked for earlier, for this thread ...

Pro 20:19  He that goeth about as a tale-bearer revealeth secrets; Therefore company not with him that openeth wide his lips.

"Christians are famous for what they are against, rather than what they are for."

When you have some spare time you can listen to that particular sermon HERE.  The music is not played on the sermons due to copyright.  However, that particular Sunday morning and service offered up a tune called Hookers and Robbers by Charlie Hall.  I'm proud to call this church home and this church I call home does not have one hymnal.  The words are presented upon screens for us to follow and we sing songs such as;

He Reigns by Newsboys (one of my favorites)

Sing to the king with a U2 twist (and I like U2)

By Your Sideby Tenth Avenue North (another favorite)

These are just a few tunes we have done at church that I really enjoy.  This is the type of music that my church plays and our average attendance is 1500 every Sunday morning.  I listen to all kinds of music.  I like anything from  Alison Krauss to White Snake  The 80's hairbands is my "back in the day" "feel good" music.  There is nothing I enjoy more than on a beautiful spring day, just after cleaning up truck, driving along with the windows down, the stereo cranked up about 20 notches past where it should be listening to some 80's bang your head hairband music.  Does this mean I'm on a highway to hell?  Nope not in my eyes.  It's music!  You find in the bible where it tells me not to listen to rock and roll, country, rap, whatever?  It's music!  What you will find is Love!  Love that I'm required to share.

Seems that it comes down to an individual or a group of folks interpreting the bible for others.  Why are you going to now question the type of music you listen too?  Because Dial The Truth says so?  I spent very little time on the site, it seems though they have problems with versions of the bible other than King James.  If this is truly the case they need to learn Hebrew and Greek the actual translations.  I could go on but I will defer to the quote you will find in my signature from Billy Graham;

"It's the Spirits job to convict, It's God's job to judge, It's my job to love"